Last night was such a fun event, one I’m still thinking about the next day: George RR Martin and Neil Gaiman in conversation, at Symphony Space. There are few authors who can sell out a concert hall, but George and Neil are two of them.

It was neat hearing them talk about science fiction and fantasy royalty. Gaiman and Martin knew each other through a mutual admiration and friendship with Roger Zelazny, and Neil said they struck up a friendship when Zelazny passed away in 1995. Martin gave high praise to Zelazny’s writing, which made me want to read more of his books.

Martin spoke much about his life and career. There were some really interesting moments in what he said about how much he struggled to succeed as a writer. He sold his first professional story in the early seventies, but said that even after some sustained success and many writing awards, it was difficult to write full time. He eventually quit a teaching job to do so, but said that at a certain point he had a hard time selling anything, which is why he went to Hollywood in the mid-eighties. He had successes there, but also frustrations with how difficult it was to get anything made, and the way studios would want to change his stories and adaptations.

In 1996, Game of Thrones was released and though it was successful, it was not until the third book in that series, A Clash of Kings, that he made the bestseller list. On a book tour supporting the novel, Martin said he would sign for around ten or so people at various Barnes and Noble bookstores. He hilariously recalled a story of when he arrived at a bookstore packed with fans, only to find out they were there for another signing, that of Clifford the Big Red dog. Later, as the series became a sensation and then was adapted by HBO, hundreds and even thousands started showing up to see him read and sign.

It’s hard to believe that a writer of Martin’s gifts toiled for so many years, at times unable to pay his bills, but his career arc is a good reminder of just how difficult it is to make it as a writer. We all know and love Game of Thrones now, but he put in decades of work before achieving such immense popularity.

Gaiman had some great stories, as well, the best of which was how he at one point pitched an idea to George for the Wild Card series George edits, but was rejected. The story was about a Dream king which, of course, became Sandman.

There was a lot of other fun talk between the two about history, and historical fiction, and Martin’s interest in writing in many different genres. I left feeling so lucky to have seen the two of them together. Fantasy rock stars. It doesn’t get much better. If you have the chance to see him, I highly recommend it. This video from earlier in the week, on Colbert, is also brilliant. Colbert is so well read and is such a good interviewer.